(AC)
Alastair Campbell, systems manager, Kyndal
(PC) Peter Callaway, planning and trading
controller, House of Fraser
(JD) John Davison, research director, GartnerG2
(PG) Peter Grindrod, technical director,
Numbercraft
(CK) Cliff Keen, retail systems manager,
TotalFinaElf
(SK) Stewart Kendall, business systems
controller, New Look
(IM) Ian Mackie, retail category manager,
TotalFinaElf
(GM) Gill Mander, analyst, GartnerG2
(LN) Lee Nash, head of buying systems,
Waitrose
(AR) Alison Rawstron, editor, Retail Systems
magazine
(JS) Jeremy Spencer, international business
development manager, Lawson
(ST) Sarah Taylor, international retail
director, Lawson
(AT) Alvaro Trujillo, pricing and margin
analyst, Woolworths
(HW) Helen Walthorne, corporate services
manager, Gap |
The
roundtable was introduced by John Davison, research
director at GartnerG2, who established that retail
revenue management (RRM) is receiving a lot of attention
in the US market, with 30 to 40 retailers investigating
the technology. He stated that the UK retail market
would follow suit, perhaps using the technology in
a slightly different way. But he emphasised that if
revenue management isnt fully integrated with
up-to-date robust systems, from the supply chain through
to the point of sale, then it will probably fail.
JD:
If you dont link RRM to customer demand you
could have
severe problems with your brand image. If you are
not very careful with dynamic pricing it will lead
you to target customers who are not price sensitive,
and these are the most loyal customers. It is very
dangerous ground. You cannot afford to break trust
with the customer. So I recommend retailers link RRM
into their Customer Relationship Management (CRM)
systems. A lot of solution providers are great on
the analytics side, but very few have CRM offers.
Where is the connection in terms of the technology?
Retail optimisation is about making better decisions.
It involves using computer systems and software, but
it also should involve customer data. These systems
are not going to release your staff from their roles
and responsibilities. In this particular arena your
buying and trading directors are still going to have
to make decisions. But are you going to get the information
to them in real time to make those decisions? And
do you have the transaction engine in place that can
cope with getting decisions made in real time? Most
of the tools currently on the market are analytics
tools, not executional tools.
Retailers are using rules-based systems in terms of
inventory, pricing management and promotions management.
Retailers operate using the 3 A rule -
aggregation, allocation and averages - because
it is a reasonably acceptable and easy way to understand
business. I think in the future retailers will be
more based on demand. Merchandising planning is a
prime example of that. The general trend is moving
away from rules-based to demand-based projections
- moving away from intuition.
The new tools on the market will offer the ability
to plan at an even more granular level, even down
to product level. So if you think you have a lot of
demand and supply information now, you can guess it
is going to be anything from four times that amount
in future. Can your systems cope with that, and are
they future-proofed? If we want to get to this new
world, there are major implications from an
architecture and systems point of view. But a lot
of the [RRM] vendors have piecemeal solutions at the
moment.
If you are going to take this seriously at the executional
level, do you have a transaction engine to do this?
Probably not. Are you ready in-store? I seriously
doubt that many retailers are ready to introduce RRM
at store level at the moment. The culture just isnt
there.
Asking
price
SK: Retailers may be able to execute a change
in price very rapidly but there is always that lead-time
between changing a price and someone making the purchase.
JD: It occurs to me that the best chance for
dynamic marketing is person-to-person marketing because
it is easier and you overcome some of the issues from
CRM. In my mind, it is almost inevitable that if we
could execute this today we would be targeting the
very customers we didnt want to target; we would
be punishing loyal customers.
AC: Do you see this getting to the stage where
you have an electronic shelf-edge label and the price
may change throughout the day or do you see it where
there is an individual price to that individual customer?
JD: Yes, to both. It just depends on the retailers.
I think if we continue on the road we are on now we
will end up with the first scenario, but I think when
people think about this the impact on the customer
in the second instance is infinitely more preferable.
But that is even further down the road. All of the
technology is driven to scenario one at the moment
and that is why most of the vendors dont have
solutions in the CRM space; they are not thinking
about that.
It is not just about maximising margin or increasing
revenue; it is back to the brand and the image of
the retailer. It takes a long time to build a brand
and it takes a long time to get a customer back. Yes,
there is a business case for all of this. There are
potential gains to be made and a lot of the figures
I have seen around 15 to 40 per cent gains. However,
the user interface has to be good because this involves
sophisticated analysis. In some respects you are talking
about moving staff from spreadsheets to sophisticated
analytical tools and we are all getting more tech-savvy,
but not that much. Our US research says 83 per cent
of retailers are still using spreadsheets to do some
form of merchandising optimisation.
JS: Of the retailers in the US what percentage
would you say are still in trial mode?
JD: I would probably say it is about 80 per
cent, but nonetheless, they are definitely further
down the road than we are. There are points of failure
for this such as the optimisation engine. Have you
got the capability to cope with all this data going
through your systems? Can your stores cope with it
and is it going to be a usable interface for people
who arent used to those types of applications?
Are you going to link it into sales and customer loyalty
data, because you have to integrate it with those
areas if you want to make it something that doesnt
turn your customers off? Very few vendors have got
the complete offer available. If I was embarking down
this route that would concern me more than anything
else. Know what you want to do and identify your pain
points. If you want to do markdowns with this then
there are only two or three vendors who would be able
to help you. If you want to do price and promotions
then it is probably slightly better. There will be
some change in business processes, both in the buying
and merchandising, pricing, supply chain and at the
store level. Yes, you may think if we introduce electronic
shelf edge labelling we will improve the store -
that is true. But there will be other things to do.
Forward
planning
AR: How essential is revenue management to
your organisation and how essential will it be in
the next few years?
LN: As a representative of a grocer, we will
look at some of these elements seriously in the next
one to two years and others not so much. Waitrose
is more conservative in some respects and we will
be very delicate with pricing. We probably could get
some benefit from basic pricing strategies and promotional
strategies, which we are relatively new to. When it
comes to dynamic pricing during the day, or anything
that involves us putting electronic shelf edges in,
I think we would need a new generation of technology
before we got involved. We would be worried about
what it looks like and the customer interface.
AC: I can imagine going to a grocery outlet
where my trolley has some sort of output device like
a GPS and tells me which products are where. If I
happen to pick up a packet of spaghetti then it offers
me 10 pence off a jar of pasta sauce. This will extract
the maximum amount of money from my wallet by offering
me add-on purchases, maybe at a slight discount.
JS: The technology fits wells with impulse
and convenience, with the caveat of the danger in
getting it right. How many retailers here are already
in some kind of trial or are seriously considering
it?
AT: Speaking from Woolworths point of
view, I think we are still a bit cautious when it
comes to revenue management. It is a new technology
and a lot of retailers are still maximising the potential
of the technology they have already purchased.
SK: Ive probably got a wish list, if
that helps. One of the things that John mentioned
was different types of merchandise profile and their
lifecycle. I represent a fashion retailer so its
all about a short lifecycle. We set the price and
thereafter it is an important tool with promotions
and markdowns. I think there would be some value in
having a tool that would help you work out the right
time to start to stimulate demand and the right point
to cut the product and move on. That is really where
spreadsheets come in because you extract out from
that data to give you an update, and then you can
do a few what-ifs on your forecast curve. If I could
find some tools that would automatically tell me where
I am on the curve then it would take away a chunk
of work, decision-making and administration. There
is still a drive on the execution side, except I wouldve
used a degree of automation and sophistication to
get there.
JS: In fashion, short cycle markdowns have
always been a challenge. Im just wondering in
some of the other sub-sectors of retail if price optimisation
is a brand new concept?
PC: I think it probably has more relevance
for petrol and grocery. Certainly in fashion there
are things that could deliver more quickly than managing
the price throughout the day. I think grocery chains
are a great example of the use of revenue management
or differential pricing. It is all about matching
the convenience to the price, and the cost of the
same item can be different in an out-of-town hypermarket,
local supermarkets and city-centred commuter branches.
Very different prices for the same product.
Lessons
from across the Atlantic
LN: What are the figures [for RRM take-up]
in grocery in the US?
JD: Well, I think you have to consider that
they are still in trial stage. What you have to bear
in mind in the UK is that the large grocers are more
innovative and adopt new technology more quickly than
those in the US. But I think it is probably the case
in the US that demarcation doesnt exist; I think
the non-food retailers are just as likely to use new
technology.
SK: I am just a little cautious about some
of the technology that comes out of the US. Its
about leapfrogging them and spotting what we really
need the technology to do, then adapting it so it
is relevant to our market.
JD: I do think it is tying it in with CRM initiatives.
CRM and revenue merchandising in so many retailers
is slightly disjointed and that is probably where
the benefit lies. CRM has failed to some extent. Retailers
have all this data, but no-one is using it yet. A
lot of UK retailers are concerned about the efficient
store and the consumer experience. This [RRM] fits
in there and no-one seems to be making the connection
- probably because it is not a priority at the
moment.
AC: The issue with CRM is that you can take
it too far and turn into a stalker, and that is when
you alienate your customer.
HW: I think thats why retailers are shying
away, because we have got bigger fish to fry. One
CRM initiative that Gap tried in the UK was taking
customers around the store and advising them. But
the English dont want it. So many of these things
are US driven and we really have to just take what
is relevant to us.
JD: There is the difference between proactively
targeting the customer and targeting the retailer
or member of staff. Even the UK public is concerned
about the level of non-interaction. We know that self-checkouts
are coming in, and that is going to be another proof
point. Do we want that level of technology in the
stores? Customers are increasingly concerned about
the technology being brought in by retailers so the
customer can do the retailers job. There could
come a point where customers demand a bit more human
interaction.
HW: Look at retailers like Metro in Germany,
which is so heavily technical that they are taking
away the entire human and personalised element. I
think that is particularly relevant in food.
Pick
n mix
JS: So far we have spoken about price or markdown
issues, but obviously assortment optimisation is one
of the components John mentioned as having a future.
Are any of you using smartness in your business to
work out which products should go in which stores?
Is that something you see as potentially having more
value-add?
PC: We have been able to divide the stores
up into different clusters by investing in datawarehouses
and transactional data, and we also have a very loyal
penetration of the in-store credit card and that is
certainly generating big improvements in the margins
of certain stores. The product types you can target
to the specific store types is matched better. In
terms of moving on with CRM, once youve got
a customer locked in, you can see their various cross-shopping
patterns across the departments of the store. You
start to see great big holes where you have very small
cross-shopping in certain types of customer and very
good cross-shopping in others, so what are the differences
and how can we understand them? Im sure those
are going to deliver us more improvement in revenue
generation.
PG: This is an area in which we have worked
extensively. Not just localisation but basic promotional
strategy, around rewarding certain types of customers
and not having to reward other types of customers.
If you have that insight then it starts off with smarter,
more tailored merchandising and ends up with more
customer-specific pricing. The corollary is that in
some outlets you need to give on price and in others
you dont.
PC: Certain customer types are much more sensitive
to price. I agree with Stewart that just having some
tools that could let us know when it is time to tweak
the price would be very helpful.
PG: In some of your sectors it wont be
about elasticity of price as elasticity will be positive;
in jewellery, and some types of apparel. They will
become undesirable if they fall below a certain price.
I think it would be easier to ask a simpler question.
In these outlets for these customers are they price
sensitive or not, is it price or choice that is driving
the purchase?
HW: For a lot of fashion retailers it is all
about the cost and perceived desirability of the garment,
for others it is all about speed from catwalk to shop
floor. It takes Zara three months to get a garment
into their stores; it takes Gap 12 months.
SK: In those fashion retailer categories there
is a community of consumers that aspire to the brand.
They help in the mop-up process and purchase items
at a cheaper price once it is falling off the fashion
curve. There are tools and techniques that can play
that advantage.
PG: That is what brand value is, the ability
to sell things at a certain price. You have the reality
of that with consumers coming through your cash tills
and choosing to buy when the moment is right for them.
I think that large grocers such as Waitrose are a
good example - its aspirational because
of the quality fruit and vegetables and the large
delicatessen counter. Probably, if we asked customers
they would be relatively price oblivious. But actually,
in the same store, if they went to the household aisle
they would still want the deal on the bleach or soap.
It must be tough because you have to cater to both
demands.
LN: The UK grocery market is driven largely
by price. We cant avoid that but weve
got a niche, we want to be the best fresh food retailer.
We have to be very careful and cant assume anything.
That is why I think we will be interested in RRM technology.
AC: The Marks & Spencer food range is a
classic example: is it own-label or is it a brand?
They have blurred the definition. But if you went
in and saw a new dish you will try it because you
trust the brand. Waitrose has the same loyalty. It
is all down to where the retailer sees itself and
where it is pitching itself.
PG: In these stores it is a challenge. You
have some places where you can drive extra footfall
through price. Through price you can get customers
to buy complementary items to the ones they were shopping
for. Through price I could know which customers are
buying what. Those tasks are very different, in terms
of getting people to move sideways, from just building
their baskets. I think that price is quite a complicated
lever, you can do all of those things that have different
KPIs and you can find out how many customers you are
getting in, what they are buying and how often. If
you said to a retailer what is your pricing strategy,
would you be able to say? It is worth taking a step
back before you go pricing or promotions crazy. Which
one of these things are you going to do, how will
you measure it, do you know who your target audience
is, and will we know when they come into the store?
ST: What Ive been hearing is not about
price but about what is the offer, how does it fit
in with your company strategy and how do you want
to be seen? Price just becomes an enabler to achieve
that sometimes, but not always.
The price is right
JD: Why isnt price the main factor? If
we start changing it will the customer notice? Is
it fair to say customers arent that bothered
about price because generally there isnt that
big a variation?
AC: I think it depends on the value of the
item. If you are going to buy a cooker for example,
you are going to do some research, surfing on the
Internet. But not for a pint of milk.
IM: Price is important but you arent
as concerned if its a low price product. For
example, cigarettes are more price sensitive because
they are bought on a regular basis.
HW: We have been doing some research recently
and what seemed to be coming back to us was that customers
would rather have better prices than loyalty card
schemes. And the vast majority of card schemes have
gone out of fashion.
ST: I think the consumers have wised up; they
dont want to be providing all this information.
CK: Shoppers are very selective and probably
only use a couple of cards regularly.
PG: And the majority of retailers that have
loyalty cards dont really squeeze the data at
all. There are a few retailers doing things in a very
clever way. I think over the last few years a lot
of retailers have got better at joining that up across
categories and doing things that are more customer-centric.
JS: If you are not running price optimisation
at a level that hangs off basket information, informing
you about key customers, isnt it somewhat dangerous?
PG: Yes, because you will either be rewarding
everybody
or nobody.
SK: Or another spin on that: say 100 customers
turn up on your door, they shop and 20 or 30 of them
translate into a transaction at the till. All through
the rest of their journey they have shopped and looked
and formed opinions. Now, just because we collect
the information at the till, put it into a datawarehouse
and analyse it, we think we know how those customers
have behaved - yet they actually represent a
small proportion of those through the door. We end
up believing that those people can tell us what the
100 were trying to do in our shops. If I had to spend
money then it would be in finding out why those shoppers
didnt shop and how to increase the chances of
them becoming a customer.
PC: One retailer who has been able to do that
for years is Argos, because you had to register what
you wanted and they could therefore register every
out-of-stock item that was wanted.
JD: What is interesting about the Internet
and web channels is that retailers can find out what
the customer wants. Retailers could formalise that
process in stores, through kiosks or email. The customer
complaints process in most stores is laughable.
SK: Ill give you another example. A typical
customer tries on many garments and buys a few. But
what made them turn some items down? We need some
capability to understand what stopped them from taking
them to the till, and whether they enjoyed their experience.
Weve got different business silos that have
different business challenges.
PG: Do you have any notion ofperformance by
category?
SK: Yes, aggregation and averages. Because
it is expensive and difficult and it changes, that
stops you from doing it. There was a time when the
store manager did it. There is some prospect here,
when we have really got an understanding of how these
tools can help us.
PC: That is interesting because Zara is going
back to that, purchasing done by the store manager.
They do their own purchasing; their systems work so
far in zzadvance they can do that.
AC: There is an interesting move away from
centralisation to localisation, which I think could
be the key. I think it is where every store might
have a different promotional range based on the demographics
of the people coming through the doors. I think that
store specific planogramming is where it is going
to be - going totally customer-centric.
Retail
Systems will be holding similar events in the future.
For more
information, please email alison.rawstron@retail-systems.com
top
|